Loading tools with "ignore tool change" checked

[derek]

I asked about this a while back and you referenced me to the sticky. I'm still confused. Is there no way to get a tool to load into "current tool" with ignore tool change checked? ? The best I can do is get it to "next tool" if I type in T# M6. I need to be able to manually call up tools without having the M6 start macro run as I also have a 10 station tool changer.

Thanks
Derek

[DaveCVI]

Hi,

I asked about this a while back and you referenced me to the sticky. I'm still confused. Is there no way to get a tool to load into "current tool" with ignore tool change checked? ?

I think the sticky you refer is the one about the bugs mach has and why it's bad to let a user enter a number into the current tool DRO directly because it causes you to get bit by those mach bugs.

I'm afraid that you've described is a catch-22 situation...
1) when Mach's "ignore tool change" option is set, mach does just that - it literally ignores any M6 command it see in gcode. This includes An M6 entered on the MDI line (as the MDI is just a way to fee a line of gcode to mach).
So no M6 will have an effect when in "ignore tool change" mode.

2) M6 is the gcode command the changes tools. This is how you tell mach what tool to load. But it can't do that if M6 is not being run due to #1 above.

Given you have a tool changer, I'd think you want to run mach in AutoTool Changer mode. Then you would add an M6ATC script to MSM and in that script you can do anything you want to handle the tool changer. (in this mode an M6 will invoke the M6ATC script).

The best I can do is get it to "next tool" if I type in T# M6.

Yes, because T# is a separate gcode preparatory command from M6. T sets the next tool number, M6 loads the tool that has been specified by a T command.
Mach has a "ignore tool change" (ignore m6) option, but not a "ignore T word option".

I need to be able to manually call up tools without having the M6 start macro run as I also have a 10 station tool changer.

Thanks
Derek

I'm missing something here about what you want to do....

To manually (without running a gcode program) call up a tool, one uses the MDI (Manual Data Input) line and enters the needed gcode (T, M6 etc). Machines with tool changers generally get tools from the changer.

Since M6 is the gcode command to change tools, why can't you use M6 to change tools?
I'm stumped by "I want to change tools, but won't use the tool change command to do so"..

Perhaps if you describe steps by steps what you are looking to have happen, I'll be able to find a way to do what you want (I sense that I don't understand what you want yet).

Dave

[derek]

Hi Dave
Thanks for the help.
I have 10 tools in the carousel that mostly reside there for an ongoing job I do. The are times in between that job where I'll do one off stuff. My work flow for that is I have a button on my screen that turns on the "ignore tool change" I then use g43 H# to call up what ever tool I'm shoving in there. I either type it in as a MDI if I'm setting a tool length or I call it up in the code. If I need a tool from the ATC I turn off the "ignore tool change" and load T#M6. Right now with MSM if I type in T2M6 with "ignore tool change" It will load it in next tool but that's as far as it goes.

This all started when I loaded up the demo on my router to see if it played nice with the UC-100 and probing.I plan to use it on my mill but the trial expired and this was easier than trying to get an extension on the trial. I set up tool number 2 as the probe. The only way I could get the probe function to work was to let the M6 script run by un checking the "ignore tool change" no matter what else I did I couldn't get the probing function to work as I kept getting the "probe tool not loaded" error. The good news is probing seems to have been fixed with the UC-100. I then started to see how it would function with my work flow and that's where I hit the wall. I may have to do some work with my ATC macro but before I did that I wanted to make sure I wasn't missing something.

I certainly like the way you handle the tool offsets as opposed the tool breaking way mach does it so I'll find a way to adapt.

Thanks
Derek

[DaveCVI]

Hi,
Here are some approaches you can take:

1) I'd stop switching to "ignore tool change mode".
Effectively you are switching the system between ATC and "no tool change" modes.
I'd guess that what you really want is "stop & wait" and ATC modes instead.
I'm assuming that the ATC is being handled by a M6ATC script. M6ATC is only called when in ATC mode.
In S&W mode, the normal MSM M6 stuff is called and you can then use that as the "manual" tool change mode (in this case it's really a not-ATC mode).
This gives you stop & wait for manual (non-ATC) tool changes and ATC operation for ATC mode changes.

2) Make ATC code smarter.
I'd not like switching tool change modes. If this were me, I'd think about running in ATC mode all the time, then modify the M6ATC script to be smarter.
There are several possibilities to consider, here is one idea:
Separate the concepts of changer pocket number from tool number. Then have the have the system know what tool #s are in what changer pocket numbers (i.e. the software will keep track of a tool to pocket mapping).
With that, if the T# is not in the changer, do a manual stop&Wait tool change, then go back to ATC mode.
In ATC mode, the next time you ask for a tool from the changer, the current spindle tool will go back to the changer as part of the tool change (updating the pocket to tool# mapping).
Also remember that T0 is mach's way to say "I have no tool mounted" - so an T0 M6 can be used to dismount a tool (i.e. nothing is in the spindle).

Dave

[derek]

Hi Dave
I'm leaning towards modifying the ATC script but I have a problem. My ATC needs to engage with empty forks. I leave a tool in the spindle. Usually T1. When I load mach for the first time I type the tool # in the tool DRO. This is how mach knows what T# is in place. The M6 macro looks at the DRO and then acts accordingly.
Here is a snip of the macro:

'********************************
OldTool = GetCurrentTool()
NewTool = GetSelectedTool()

If NewTool = OldTool Then
Message" Same Tool, NO ACTION"
End
End If

IF NewTool > 10 OR NewTool < 1 then
MsgBox" Tool # not a valid Number 1-10 ONLY, ENDING Program RUN "
DoButton(3)
End
End If


Here is an early video of the ATC in case your interested.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zcv-ej45 ... e=youtu.be

Thanks
Derek

[DaveCVI]

You may want to look at the mach general options and see if "tool Selections Persistent" is checked. If checked this tells mach to save the current tool # between sessions. That will remove the problem at most start ups of mach.

Of course, there are still ways that things can get out of sync, so you need some way to reset the current tool # for the tool in the spindle. I'd do that by changing to stop & wait mode, then doing a T# M6 via MDI. Now that mach's current tool # matches what's in the spindle, switch back to ATC. With the Tool Selection persistent this would only be needed once in a while.

If that will get you going, then you can take time to think about how fancy you want to make the ATC code at your leisure.

Dave

[derek]

Thanks Dave.
That sounds like a reasonable workaround.

Derek