does anyone know if MSM will work with mach4
does anyone know if MSM will work with mach4
I see that mach4 is on the horizon will MSM mill and turn work with the new release of software
Re: does anyone know if MSM will work with mach4
Hi,
Recent updates to the Mach web site have caused people to start asking CVI about this subject again.
What follows is the current CVI position wrt to mach 4:
Mach4 has been on the horizon for at least 4 years.... we've come to think of it as one of those shimmery horizon's that you see just ahead when driving and there is a lot of heat on a road....
The last publicly announced "firm" release target for mach 4 (before the end of 2012) is now 7 months overdue...
The new machsupport website update just says "coming soon"... it does not even give a date for the start of an alpha test release...
So let's skip past the question of "when?", since there is no reliable answer to that.
Instead, let's assume you could buy mach 4 today; What would you get by "upgrading" to mach 4?
Many people assume that mach 4 is an upgrade to Mach 3; i.e. that it will be just a case of run the mach4 installer and you are all done and everything will continue working as before - just like when you change mach 3 release versions now.
That's a bad assumption.
Mach 4 is a newly written, different program that has been designed to be NOT backwards compatible with Mach 3.
As of the latest info I have, here are some major features of Mach 3 that will not work with mach 4:
- Any/all mach3 plugins (totally different interface)
- Any/all Mach3 scripts (the script language is different in Mach 4)
- Any/all brains (brains are simply not supported at all in mach 4)
- Any/all mach3 screen sets (totally different approach in mach 4)
You may notice that these bullets are pretty much the entire list of tools that are used to interface mach 3 to a machine.
About the only thing that is supposed to transfer from mach3 to mach4 is a gcode file (and even there I have heard tale of some gcode changes, though those are supposed to be minor).
Artsoft decided to abandon compatibility with mach 3. They have also publicly said that mach 4 will not have all the (equivalent) features of mach 3 for at least a year after mach 4's release.
Consider that MSM is implemented as a mach3 screen set with functionality extensions written in mach3's scripting language, and that it probably exercises more of mach's features than any other mach enhancement package...
Mach4's lack of mach 3 compatibility means that The current MSM product will not work with Mach 4.
Next people tend to ask: "Will CVI make a new release of MSM to work with mach 4"?
To make a "MSM for mach 4" will require a near total rewrite of MSM. That will be a significant effort - as the saying goes "MSM was not built in a day"...
Therefore, whether that is an investment in time and money that makes sense for CVI is a question that is unanswered.
Business wise, a "MSM for mach4" product needs a potential customer base who might buy the product.
So CVI is interested in the answer to the question: At what rate will mach3 users "upgrade" to mach 4?
Consider that moving from mach3 to mach 4 means you get to re-implement your machine's CNC control interface. CVI suspects that many mach3 users will not want to upgrade until mach4 has been out for at least a year. That would give time for missing features to be added and allow some time for mach4 to stabilize (CVI doesn't think mach4 will be the first software program in the history of computing to be released bug free as version 1.0). CVI's MSM users tend to be advanced mach 3 users who are using machines to make real parts; this is exactly the group that would have the hardest time making an early move to mach 4.
CVI will not decide about continued investment in the "MSM for Mach4" project until some time after Mach 4 is released.
That decision will be influenced by MSM user reactions to Mach4... but that can't happen until after mach4 is formally released and there actually are some mach4 users.
We'd be interested in hearing what your plans for Mach4 are...
Dave
Yep. I know the answer to that....adam wrote:I see that mach4 is on the horizon will MSM mill and turn work with the new release of software
Recent updates to the Mach web site have caused people to start asking CVI about this subject again.
What follows is the current CVI position wrt to mach 4:
Mach4 has been on the horizon for at least 4 years.... we've come to think of it as one of those shimmery horizon's that you see just ahead when driving and there is a lot of heat on a road....
The last publicly announced "firm" release target for mach 4 (before the end of 2012) is now 7 months overdue...
The new machsupport website update just says "coming soon"... it does not even give a date for the start of an alpha test release...
So let's skip past the question of "when?", since there is no reliable answer to that.
Instead, let's assume you could buy mach 4 today; What would you get by "upgrading" to mach 4?
Many people assume that mach 4 is an upgrade to Mach 3; i.e. that it will be just a case of run the mach4 installer and you are all done and everything will continue working as before - just like when you change mach 3 release versions now.
That's a bad assumption.
Mach 4 is a newly written, different program that has been designed to be NOT backwards compatible with Mach 3.
As of the latest info I have, here are some major features of Mach 3 that will not work with mach 4:
- Any/all mach3 plugins (totally different interface)
- Any/all Mach3 scripts (the script language is different in Mach 4)
- Any/all brains (brains are simply not supported at all in mach 4)
- Any/all mach3 screen sets (totally different approach in mach 4)
You may notice that these bullets are pretty much the entire list of tools that are used to interface mach 3 to a machine.
About the only thing that is supposed to transfer from mach3 to mach4 is a gcode file (and even there I have heard tale of some gcode changes, though those are supposed to be minor).
Artsoft decided to abandon compatibility with mach 3. They have also publicly said that mach 4 will not have all the (equivalent) features of mach 3 for at least a year after mach 4's release.
Consider that MSM is implemented as a mach3 screen set with functionality extensions written in mach3's scripting language, and that it probably exercises more of mach's features than any other mach enhancement package...
Mach4's lack of mach 3 compatibility means that The current MSM product will not work with Mach 4.
Next people tend to ask: "Will CVI make a new release of MSM to work with mach 4"?
To make a "MSM for mach 4" will require a near total rewrite of MSM. That will be a significant effort - as the saying goes "MSM was not built in a day"...
Therefore, whether that is an investment in time and money that makes sense for CVI is a question that is unanswered. Business wise, a "MSM for mach4" product needs a potential customer base who might buy the product.
So CVI is interested in the answer to the question: At what rate will mach3 users "upgrade" to mach 4?
Consider that moving from mach3 to mach 4 means you get to re-implement your machine's CNC control interface. CVI suspects that many mach3 users will not want to upgrade until mach4 has been out for at least a year. That would give time for missing features to be added and allow some time for mach4 to stabilize (CVI doesn't think mach4 will be the first software program in the history of computing to be released bug free as version 1.0). CVI's MSM users tend to be advanced mach 3 users who are using machines to make real parts; this is exactly the group that would have the hardest time making an early move to mach 4.
CVI will not decide about continued investment in the "MSM for Mach4" project until some time after Mach 4 is released.
That decision will be influenced by MSM user reactions to Mach4... but that can't happen until after mach4 is formally released and there actually are some mach4 users.
We'd be interested in hearing what your plans for Mach4 are...
Dave
Productivity Software for Personal CNC Machinists
http://www.CalypsoVentures.com
http://www.CalypsoVentures.com
Re: does anyone know if MSM will work with mach4
Quite honestly, I've been very pleased with mach3/MSM for the limited use that I make of my mill. I'm really pleased with the MSM interface and as such see no reason to switch to mach4 until either MSM or a MSM-like interface is available. MSM, Ver 1.1.11 does everything I need and, though I'm intrigued with some of the added features that newer versions of MSM offer, I find it hard to justify the time that it would take to upgrade AND the time it would take me to learn how to use these features. (I'm a slow learner ) Thanks Dave for a great product!
) Thanks Dave for a great product!